John Christensen
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| 06 Aug 2010 02:47 AM |
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I was asked today to give a bid on a large ktchen countertop job. Full height coved backsplash and other extras. I was asked if it was possible to incorporate a wide area of tile at both sides of a drop in cooktop. The tile would only be the depth of the cooktop from front to back and begin underneath the side flange and extend to the sides 14". The solid surface would be continuous behind and in front of the cooktop. I said that we could do it and then proceeded to ask what their intention was for the tile. The customer has always had laminate tops with tile next to the stove. They used the tile area to set their canner on while it cooled down. RED FLAG, RED FLAG, RED FLAG. My first thought was to make the countertop double thickness where the tile would be and rout out the depth of the tile to receive the tile, acrylic grout in the field and silicone around the perimeter. then I got to thinking about how much heat would be transfered even through the tile (assume 1/4" thick tile) during the duration of time that a canner would sit there to cool down. Might still be a heat problem. I think that tha tile would be at the same temperature all the way through in about 4-5 minutes. I would rather see them use large SS trivets with 1/2" tall feet underneath to create large air gap. I would appreciate a sharing of concerns and suggestions.  Thanks, Johnny C |
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Lenny E
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| 06 Aug 2010 03:04 AM |
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Put in the tile, and not over top of SS. I have tile in the kitchen in the Texas house, Granite in the China house, and both are impervious to heat. I have SS removed from the heat areas. I also do a bit of canning. From experience tile will perform. Sloshing tile over SS will be a thermal expansion mismatch and just be asking for future failures. |
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Bill Wolle
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| 06 Aug 2010 05:27 PM |
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Johnny,
Go ahead with the tile. Do not recess the tile into the SS top. Clear cut the SS and install the tile on cement backer board installed in the hole like an inlay. In other words, no SS under the tile. It will work fine then. |
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Karl Crooks
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| 06 Aug 2010 08:03 PM |
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I agree with the above, make them like 2 separate counters as much as you can with a bead of silicone. not grout betwine them.  |
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RESTORE ~ RENEW ~ REJOICE !
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John Christensen
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| 06 Aug 2010 08:35 PM |
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Lenny, Bill and karl.
Thanks for your responses. After consideration, I think Bill's idea would isolate the different materials and make this do-able.
Lets knock this around a bit more. Any other ideas?
Johnny C |
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Kelsey Crisp
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| 06 Aug 2010 11:03 PM |
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I would just upsale to quartz. I think that senario would look kinda dumb..IMO.
Are they so weird as customers, they would not like to take a trivet or on a maple cutting board, like I do in my own kitchen...and sit a canner a few times a year??
I had a customer ask me to run a 4" backsplash once across the back of a freestanding range. Looked stupid, told them it would, and then paid me to come back and remove it and do it right... |
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Karl Crooks
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| 07 Aug 2010 01:52 AM |
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Posted By Kelsey Crisp on 06 Aug 2010 05:03 PM
I would just upsale to quartz. I think that senario would look kinda dumb..IMO.
Are they so weird as customers, they would not like to take a trivet or on a maple cutting board, like I do in my own kitchen...and sit a canner a few times a year??
I had a customer ask me to run a 4" backsplash once across the back of a freestanding range. Looked stupid, told them it would, and then paid me to come back and remove it and do it right... I agree it will look very odd ! How would Quartz be better than Solid Surface ? Eather way it would be best to use a trivet / hot plate. |
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Kelsey Crisp
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| 07 Aug 2010 04:07 AM |
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Karl, you think sitting a pressure canner on Silestone would do anything to it... versus sitting it on SS? I don't think Silestone or any quartz would be affected by the hot prolong heat, but I bet acrylic would?
When I melt lead for my fishing jigs, I'll rest the hot pan on a piece of silestone, never had anything happen to it. ??
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Lenny E
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| 07 Aug 2010 04:18 AM |
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Hi Kelsey, Im betting nothing would happen to tile either. And the customer requested tile. Give em what they want! If you replace tile with silestone after the customer requested tile and anything happens (especially if there is a woman, housewife significant other invoved).. the be -aching will never cease! You would rue the day you were born. Its just simple material science and psychology!  |
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Norm Walters
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| 07 Aug 2010 04:23 PM |
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I had a quartz job that left a white scorch mark from a hot pan, couldn't be repaired, replaced the section. Mike Gladstone can confirm this. |
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Gene McDonald
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| 07 Aug 2010 04:30 PM |
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why cant we just get these people who ask this question all the time...if they can just leave the hot pot on the stove and turn off the flame...Its the new thing to do to save and show off counter space  ...i know..it will never bite..but i tried |
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David Gerard
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| 07 Aug 2010 05:23 PM |
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Kelsey, your wife lets you melt lead on her stove....in the house? |
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Karl Crooks
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| 07 Aug 2010 10:15 PM |
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Posted By Kelsey Crisp on 06 Aug 2010 10:07 PM
Karl, you think sitting a pressure canner on Silestone would do anything to it... versus sitting it on SS? I don't think Silestone or any quartz would be affected by the hot prolong heat, but I bet acrylic would?
When I melt lead for my fishing jigs, I'll rest the hot pan on a piece of silestone, never had anything happen to it. ??
Our experience has been different  |
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Kowboy
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| 09 Aug 2010 12:13 AM |
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Posted By Kelsey Crisp on 06 Aug 2010 10:07 PM
Karl, you think sitting a pressure canner on Silestone would do anything to it... versus sitting it on SS? I don't think Silestone or any quartz would be affected by the hot prolong heat, but I bet acrylic would?
When I melt lead for my fishing jigs, I'll rest the hot pan on a piece of silestone, never had anything happen to it. ??
Kelsey: Are you being sarcastic? Really, I can't tell. Joe |
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| ...One ought to choose likely impossibilities in preference to unconvincing possibilities.- Aristotle |
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Andy Graves
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| 28 Aug 2010 08:52 PM |
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I think it would be fine. Looks would be subjective so that is not the fabricator's concern. It would be the same application as a slide in range. Of course you would need an expansion gap between the tile and solid surface. |
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John Christensen
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| 19 Nov 2010 06:49 PM |
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Thanks for all the input guys. I put a price on it to discourage the idea...... Got the job anyway, so here is what I did. They wanted the tile to begin under the cooktop flange and extend out the size of the tile.  I added an extra layer of Deck material under the tile cutout and then another layer to create a lip. Now I have a 15/16" deep well fot tile support and tile.  Al of the corners are reinforced in the first additional layer and the cooktop corners are double reinforced.   I used 11 ply 3/4" plywood for tile support. I cut a rabbet in the underside so that the remaining well would allow the tile to be as flush as possible with the deck. Allowed 1/8" space all around the ply.  I left a 3/32" space all around the tile. I used a translucent tan silicone for the grout. I also sanded the corners of the tile tao fit the 3/16" radii at the corners of the cutout.   This is a small counter between the oven cab and the refer. cab. Hardly worth it but they wanted the tile inset here also.  The customers wanted the wood strip at the backsplash just to break up the vastness of the full height splash. It turned out better than I thought it would. The job was 2-1/2 hrs. from my shop, so I had a very long day yesterday. I measured and templated another job within 10 minutes of this before heading home. Johnny C |
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Steve Mehan
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| 19 Nov 2010 11:51 PM |
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I like it. Alot of work I can see went into the the cooktop buildup support. How much overhang is on the penninsula? |
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Kowboy
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| 21 Nov 2010 07:49 PM |
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Johnny:
Very nice again.
Thanks,
Joe |
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John Christensen
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| 21 Nov 2010 10:38 PM |
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Posted By Steve Mehan on 19 Nov 2010 05:51 PM
I like it. Alot of work I can see went into the the cooktop buildup support. How much overhang is on the penninsula? Steve: This was a remodel and the original cabinets had a very elaborate corbel system that was built into the cabinet. The overhand was 12" on the ends and the side opposite the stove. Johnny C |
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Andy Graves
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| 03 Dec 2010 06:23 PM |
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When you look at the picture of the finished top this looks easy. Then when you see the setup and underside in the other pictures, I can only imagine the amount of work involved especially without a cnc.
Great work.
Did you silicone between the solid surface and tile or is it removable? |
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