Posted By Tom M on 13 Apr 2010 06:27 PM
Okay.
My version of that quote comes from "Stuff Jefferson Said" Vol.1867 - Random House, and concludes thusly:

"And believed if you hail from Michigan."

Tom:

Now that's what I like. Busted fair and square. I have no idea if that quote is genuine or not, but I just ran across it, thought of Wags and posted.

I may try to verify, I may not.

Joe

But seriously, Joe, you are talking about the guy who believed - and expressed his belief in the first or second most important document in our nation's history - that all of our natural rights as citizens and human beings are "endowed by our (their) creator".

I'd say that's a slam dunk, right there.

Unless he was kidding, the bi[g] lug.

Sorry for the cross-post.

Ace of Spades kept a troll going for hours by making up quotes from Jefferson in the comments. The resource for the quotes was always "Stuff Jefferson Said". It was a riot.

Wags,
One thing to keep in mind is that all these stories about crime are driven, as most news stories are, by topical situations. An area may have a recent increase in crime, a reporter may think it logical that, in a poor economy, crime may well increase, so he gives his article a more attention-getting spin.

I think the economy has been tanked for too short a time to make any pure assignations that it is the cause.

Unfortunately, we may have plenty of rotten days ahead to find out for sure.

Tom:

I did make a slight effort to substantiate my previous quote. While I haven't been successful yet, I did find this.

As you can see, unlike my previous, all have attribution. Judging from that stack, if mine was a phony, it was a damn believeable one.

Joe

Tom:

I stand corrected. It is believeable, because it's true. It's in a letter from Jefferson to John Adams, April 11, 1823.

Joe

Posted By Tom M on 13 Apr 2010 06:40 PM
Sorry for the cross-post.

Ace of Spades kept a troll going for hours by making up quotes from Jefferson in the comments. The resource for the quotes was always "Stuff Jefferson Said". It was a riot.

Tom.. are you referring to the "Troll" as mentioned in the Stone site?

Joe,

Please start another thread on seperation of Church and State. You are going off topic as usual, plus I like to keep my figurative slaps to youre head compartmentalized and on topic.

Thanks for understanding.

Tom,

You derailer of threads. I suggest we discuss this in another thread dedicated to the topic.

Posted By Lenny E on 13 Apr 2010 07:10 PM
Joe,

Please start another thread on seperation of Church and State. You are going off topic as usual, plus I like to keep my figurative slaps to youre head compartmentalized and on topic.

Thanks for understanding.

Tom,

You derailer of threads. I suggest we discuss this in another thread dedicated to the topic.

Lenny:

A little thread drift is a good thing and if there ever was a thread that needed hijacking, it's this one.

Check out "Chads Left Integra?". Bill Wolle and I are four-wheelin' that sucker through the woods waay off the track.

Joe

Tom the bad economy has been around for several years, plenty of time for someone out of work to become desperate. Now if it will continue, decrease or increase is the question. Quoting, as Joe has done, 5 year stats, is of little relevence to
what is happening today.

Posted By Kowboy on 13 Apr 2010 07:16 PM

Posted By Lenny E on 13 Apr 2010 07:10 PM
Joe,

Please start another thread on seperation of Church and State. You are going off topic as usual, plus I like to keep my figurative slaps to youre head compartmentalized and on topic.

Thanks for understanding.

Tom,

You derailer of threads. I suggest we discuss this in another thread dedicated to the topic.

Lenny:

A little thread drift is a good thing and if there ever was a thread that needed hijacking, it's this one.

Check out "Chads Left Integra?". Bill Wolle and I are four-wheelin' that sucker through the woods waay off the track.

Joe

Joe,

I could care less what you and Billl Wolle have been up to in other threads. Please keep on topic or post another thread.

Posted By Wags on 13 Apr 2010 07:22 PM
Tom the bad economy has been around for several years, plenty of time for someone out of work to become desperate. Now if it will continue, decrease or increase is the question. Quoting, as Joe has done, 5 year stats, is of little relevence to
what is happening today.

Wags:

Now I know why you don’t like relevant historical statistical information. You’re complaining about five-year-old information, let’s go back ten years when the National Crime Index rose 2.1% from 2000-2001. As I recall, times were pretty good right before 9/11, so here you had a rising economy and a rising crime rate.

Look back even further and you’ll find that five and ten years before 2001, crime dropped 10.2% and 17.9% respectively.

Here's some fresh stuff.


Joe

Lenny:

Unlike a technical post, no one's livelihood is going to be affected by this thread unless they're reading it when they should be working.

It's a bulletin board Lenny. Lighten up.

Geesh,

 

Joe

KC, I was using "troll" in the generic web sense, as an unwanted person there to stir up trouble, rather than the stone site's "specific person" who shall remain unnamed for the purpose of this thread meaning.

Lenny, yeah, guilty as charged, but I was reacting versus redirecting. For the record, I mean.

Joe, where do you think Jefferson came down on the role of religion, not "A" Religion, but 'religion' in terms of personal and governmental importance?

troll....   gotcha Tom

Posted By Tom M on 14 Apr 2010 12:18 PM
KC, I was using "troll" in the generic web sense, as an unwanted person there to stir up trouble, rather than the stone site's "specific person" who shall remain unnamed for the purpose of this thread meaning.

Lenny, yeah, guilty as charged, but I was reacting versus redirecting. For the record, I mean.

Joe, where do you think Jefferson came down on the role of religion, not "A" Religion, but 'religion' in terms of personal and governmental importance?

Tom:

I think that Jefferson realized, like I do, that there are so many different religions that the only way to successfully have a country is to separate the two distinctly.

When we come together as a public, we pretty much agree that we need cops, roads and national defense. We start to diverge when you don't want me to buy wine on Sunday.

If the religious will just keep their religion where it belongs, in their homes, churches and private schools and out of the lives and business of the rest of us, things would be just fine.

Joe

Is that why the first congress, had a bible printed to be used in schools ? interesting Joe.. Need to read the ORIGINAL papers of the founding fathers... not the "revised history" of the last 100 years.

The Founding Fathers debate may or may not be interesting, but a genuinely relevant question would be "What do you want today?". If there is too little religion in public life today, then how much do you want? Where? Which religion? If it's Christianity, do all denominations get treated equally? How about Jews? Do Muslims ever get to hold the mic when we're praying in school or other public places? Can my "religion" be Atheism? Do I ever get to hold the mic? Complaints about the way things are seem common, but I rarely see or hear specific and comprehensive proposals for how things ought to be. I think the reason for that is that agreement among the religious falls to pieces as soon as they're expected to do more than complain.

Having a silent moment of pray before an event would be totally appropriate. You can pray or not pray to whomever or whatever you want, or just be silent and think about the lint in your navel... it's all up to you.

If I was in the Israel, I would expect to hear Jewish prayers, if I was in most of the middle east I would expect Muslim prayers.. same I saw and heard Buddhist prayers and Catholic prayers in Viet Nam.. What's the saying.. when in Rome do as the Romans?

If I have to be tolerant of others feelings, why don't they have to be tolerant of mine?