Im in the market to buy a used cnc router. I still need to do some homework and research. there are too many brands out there and I want to make sure I make the right investment, with this tight economy, but i know theres are good deals out there. Dont want to over buy and have a machine that has too many bells and whistles which i wont use or i dont need.
   We fabricate self edge countertops,Corian,staron etc. residential cabinets and commercial frameless casework. We currently have cabinetvision, and cut all with delta unisaws.
Need advice

Hello Chino,

I would suggest getting something that is fairly new. Old machines tend to need repairs and the components are expensive.

You may also want to check to make sure the company that makes your machine is still in business and has part available.

Be sure to get a table that can cut a full sheet of solid surface. My bed is 60x145 which makes it easy to cut two full sheets.

Consider the type of power the CNC will need. If you want to run three phase, you need to make sure your building has it available.

Air dryer is a must. The air going through the spindle needs to be perfectly dry or else it will damage the bearings in the spindle.

If I think of other stuff, I will post it.

Make sure the cnc you get has a tool changer. Mine doesn't. it is kinda of a pain to change the tools manually not impossible but annoying. nick

Andy,First I want to say it was GREAT to meet you in the flesh and blood at Vegas .Hope you didnt loose any money.
Guys, I really appreciate all the info, we have been fabricating since 1993,We are currently six in the shop and all we have is three Delta unisaws, Miter boxes and small hand tools. We have done great with production and wehave been profitable, but mostly because ive been inthe back pushing and keeping quality control where it should be.
Last year I came very close to buying a new CNC Looked at the Weeke and Onsrud Both about 100,000. I chickened out at the last minute. Scared of the payments. Wasnt sure if the work was going to support it.
More important I was lost there were minor diffrent things that each machine had that were diffrent than the other
1- Z axis is 3.9 , vs 7 ( more money) is that enough or am i gonna be short later?????
2-the vaccum four pumps vs. one ??????
3-10 HP vs 12 Hp spindle is this enough
Weeke , Onsrud ,Multicam , Thermwood, AXYZ etc.... which one is economical and has good support since I've been using unisaw for the last twenty years. I still have to learn ?????

Still have alot to learn

Thanks Nick, I will make sure that is one of the options I will insist on. I was told that I really didnt need one .
I believe the tool changer is a good option to have.

Chino,
A 2 1/2 D CNC (X and Y axis plus height, or Z axis change) will handle 99% of anything you would need for a standard job. Companies like Jon's, who specialize in some truly outstanding work, need a 3-D axis (where the head turns at angles).

You do not need that right now. If things go as well for you as they do for most of us who buy CNC routers, you will have spent wisely and won't regret having to upgrade later. Oh, and we have the quick change option rather than the tool changer, but I'm not sure I wouldn't spend the extra to get it if I had to do it again.

We have an AXYZ machine and, although it is more than ten years old, we still enjoy excellent service from them. We bought the 7012, which gives us almost 7 feet by 12.5 feet of cutting surface. Here's why:

When designing for the CNC fabrication, you have two ways to look at the job. One, you take a regular sheet, or sheets of material and draw up all your components - the legs of the tops, the build up, seam support, etc., and route them to glue them up. I think most fabricators on this forum use that method.

Two, you can do what we do, and that would be to glue up your legs excepting for any field joints, and include enough material to route all build up with all corners, etc. to come out as one piece glue ups, which will automatically stagger joints and give you a smoother gluing up process. The key here is to preglue a large enough piece to get all these cuts out of it.

A 36" wide peninsula, about 6 feet long with a sink wall leg about 9 feet long might actually go in the CNC as an "L" shape about 10 feet long by 7 feet long with a peninsula width of about 44". All build up, pre glued top shape and support are all routed out with less seam hassle for the glue up. Takes longer to set up, but it saves you in the end.

I like the tool changer but I don't think it is absolutely necessary if you don't have the money.

You will probably find that you don't need all the employees that you currently have. If you got rid of one person, that will pay for the CNC payments and you will be able to do a lot more work. Hate to see a person go, but that is capitalism.

Don't forget to add in Electric bill to your monthly payment. Running the spindle, vacuum and dust collector gets expensive.

Goog to meet you at the show as well Chino.

Hey guys I know im asking alot of questions. The info you have given me these last couple of days have been great.
We fab about six self edge tops a day I know you cut your substrate, build up and can even do your sink cutout on the CNC. My big question is can I also cut my plastic laminate decks and edgebands and over size it . or that something I would still have to do manually
Thanks for the help

I don't do laminate, but couldn't you glue up the laminate and then cut the counters to exact shape on the CNC? Apply the edge after.

It's not worth cutting the self edge on the CNC, unless there is an unusual shape to it.

It might be worth cutting the laminate if you wish to nest material, or if the shape is unusual and prohibitive from simply routing it back. If you do this you will benefit from overlaying plastic over the laminate so you get better suction.

We've done some inlay border cuts this way.

Hello Chino,

We have a 72" x 144" AXYZ machine with a toolchanger. It's three years old now and I don't think I would ever want to go back to the Old Ways of doing solid surface. We are now doing 3CM SS and life is very easy with the machine. Along with the toolchanger comes a quick release spindle. We have found that on most jobs we can actually get the job done faster by changing the tools by hand. Takes about 6 seconds. Your going to stay with the machine while it's cutting so it's no big deal to change tools. SS dosn't require many tool changes for most jobs anyway.

We also use the mackine to cut Melamine and MDF for our cabinet shop dealers. Over the three years we have owned the machine it has paid for itself this way. Again most jobs use only a few tools, so we don't use the toolchanger.

Buying a machine with a good reputation for support and service is parmount when making your decision. If your going to cut dozens of jobs a day, every day, then you need a heavier machine than if you are cutting a handful each day. remember you will probably cut more than you initially think. We bought ours to cut SS and now cut far more Melamine board and MDF than anything else. Once you have a machine work will magically appear, at least until every one has a machine.

We went to visit with Tom and Jon along with going to several shows to see machines and get a feel for what each could do. We decided on the AXYZ and have no regrets. It's a good match for what we do. It's easy to maintain and is capable of far more than we ask of it. The service and support is fantastic. A couple of months ago we lost a Y axis bearing. A call to AXYZ and we had a new bearing by courier the next day. 15 minutes on the phone to our tech support guy and I was ready to change the bearings out. Took about a half hour tops and cost about $200. Other than grease and bits that's about all we have spent on maintenance.

Good luck


Paul

Chino, We also bought an AXYZ machine about 3 years ago. I had many problems with the machine when it came to us (Brand New). Thnak god AXYZ has great customer service. Although they had to send a tech out and it took about two weeks to get my machine up and running it worked out good. The other good thing is while troubleshooting the problem we basically tore the machine apart and put it back together. I learned alot.

I use my machine to cut self edge jobs if there is odd shapes etc. but other than that it is quicker to use a table saw.

Hi Guillermo,
                     Cnc machinery is a must nowdays to be more competitive in the marketplace it may be scarey buying one but when you buy  one you will never look back.

I have worked on a few different machines but the best machinery to buy is the German made machines by Homag.
 
We have two a weeke 3 axis and a boff711 5 axis they are easy to programme in the woodwop software and the tech support is second to none.

For the 5 axis machine we use topsolid software which seems to be the competitor to alphcam.we have had no problems so far with this and seems to be working well.

We went out to germany to their factory to see how the cncs were made, they have a huge factory and very impressive and organised in what they do.

Dave
         Sheffield  England

Well we finally bought a weeke.This probably one of the wisest decisions I have made. I believe eventually everyone will have one. but Its great having one. Our work has tripled we are doing more commercial work and have even hired more workers. Life is great with a weeke

Post a picture if you can.

What size is the table?