I think we are going to have to wait until February because without a vote from the members, absolutely nothing can be done.

There is going to have to be a comprehensive plan before decisions can be made,

ISSFA made their mark in history for two main things.  First they forced the manufacturer in power and gave it to the fabricator.  Second, they started a grass roots show at the peak of the solid surface market.

Times have drastically changed and working to provide an association that requires dues from members is going to be difficult.  Among the 350 remaining fabricator members, you will have to assume that 20% of the hard line members will drop out when their membership is up.  You may gain some of the older members that have left.  Then you will have to hustle to gain new members in these economic times.  Not to mention, I don't see many in the laminate, tile, wood, stainless steel, glass or natural stone industries wanting to participate in a one-size fits all type of organization.

I remember when Cygnus changed the magazine to an all surfaces publication.  Smart move because the magazine is affordable and now it is free to anyone that signs up.  Will ISSFA be able to publish a top quality magazine to help the fabricator and make money doing it.

I would like to see ISSFA move to more of a PR firm for the countertop industry, putting out business information that pertains to the countertop fabricator.  This may not be so important in the short term, but as new products hit the market, companies will need to get the work out to the fabricators.  What better way to do this than a well respected Public Relations association that deals solely with surfacing materials.  They would also act to deceminate press releases about all products to the main stream media.

Can't wait to see more information and a clear, defined plan.

Andy,

I recently downloaded a copy of the ISSFA fabricator members list from the ISSFA website. It had 705 fabricator members on the list. I went through the entire list and didn't find any associate members there. Oxley confirmed to me the other day that ISSFA has approximately 700 fabricator members.

Actually, I'm not assuming that 20% of existing members will not renew. My opinion is it may go the other way once folks have a better understanding of what is in store.

I think you can count on members paying dues to belong to ISSFA. It will probably be similar to what is in effect now. ISSFA's challenge is to demonstrate the benefits of belonging to the association.

Norm,

I didn't think your post was negative at all.

Russ

If that is the case with the number of members that is great.  What leads you to believe you will be able to retain those folks that want a solid surface association only?  Retaining members is much less costly then acquiring new ones.

Counting on members paying dues in this economy may be a challenging endeavor.

I am not trying to be negative, I am trying to shed light on a massive change with an organization that doesn't have such a great track record over the last 5 years.

The changes taking place are significant in that the current Articles of Incorporation are, essentially, product based. In other words, the association currently exists to promote two product categories only.

The new Articles would place the emphasis on the fabricator. Thus, ISSFA would evolve from an organization that promotes two specific products to an organization that promotes the fabricator and his business, regardless of what products he sells.

I'll try to illustrate with an example. In the old days, lots of fabricators built their businesses around a specific brand of solid surface. Because they were dependent on that brand name, they also had to tow the line regardless of whether it was good for their own businesses or not. Once fabricators broke free of promoting the brand name exclusively and started promoting their businesses as the source of a truly great countertop, they gained a measure of autonomy.

ISSFA recognizes that most of its fabricators sell several types of decorative surfacing and that, with time, they will investigate even more options. We want to help the fabricator become more profitable across the board -- not just in solid surface or quartz. We want to facilitate essential training and promote the interests of the total business. Expanding the limitations in the Articles allows us to do that.

Now, with all that I just said, I realize ISSFA has largely abdicated in the past its responsibility to properly promote solid surface and quartz. One thing it has done is provide training. The essential elements of the changes occuring at ISSFA are geared to address and remedy those glaring inefficiencies.

In Todd Werstler's announcement of the change he mentioned there will be areas of focus within the association dedicated to specific product categories. People who care will be specifically tasked to put their efforts toward finding opportunities to promote their product specialty within those areas of focus. The groundwork for that is already being laid.

I promised not to make a lot of empty promises at the beginning of this thread, yet here I am saying don't look at the past, just look at the future. I apologize for that. It just seems better to shed a little more light on what's going on than to leave you with sketchy information.

Russ,
Do you know when the conference agreement runs out with Cygnus?

I assume you are talking about the trade show? February 2009 is the last year.

Obvious follow-up:
Any talk about taking the show back?

Obvious reply:
Can I get back to you on that?

Heh.

Russ,

I want to be clear that me goal is not to be the big, wet blanket and have a negative attitude.  My purpose is to explore the past and present value.  Without knowing why it has  been unsuccessful for the past 5 years, it will be impossible to make significant changes.

Hiring you is a start, but you are only one piece to a very large puzzle.  I see confidence low and many bridges still burning.

Andy,

I know you are sincere. Everything you have done with FabNet, countertopreview.com, etc. shows you have the interests of fabricators at heart first and foremost.

I am as interested as you to lay bare the beast that is ISSFA for public inspection. Probably the only difference between us is that I think an energized and focused ISSFA represents the best hope for providing essential services to the fabrication community. I get the feeling you believe there is little chance of success today for almost any mid-size trade association in an environment of the Free Internet and free access to information.

In my mind, it all comes down to benefits provided. FabNet offers huge benefits to fabricators free of charge. It's an unbeatable service to the community. I think ISSFA can complement that effort with other tangible benefits that have real impact on fabrication businesses.

I'll give you one suggestion you can put to use immediately, Russ.
Post the minutes of the board meetings on the member's section of the web site.

Redact what you have to, but only what you have to.

Good suggestion.

You stated, "The best hope for providing essential services to the fabrication community."

I have been hearing this since I worked with ISSFA.  They have actually improved but i felt the best part of ISSFA was the training.  Now that the training is not being attended, I completely understand why it may need some streamlining.

So as you stated, what is the essential services that the fabricators need?  If unknown; who, when and how will this be determined?

Last, I feel that a trade association can be viable.  It's just that it can't be the same old association.  Plus, if I didn't think it could work, I wouldn't bother asking tough questions.

  Russ, I realize you have been nominated as the spokesman for ISSFA, but I think the current BOD should come on the Fabnet and start a discussion about all of this.

  Now that this has become ISSFA's Bulletin Board, so to speak, with the addition of Zary South and the fact that ISSFA's BB has had a permanent technical meltdown, why not have a real discussion with the folks ISSFA plans to recruit or keep, whatever.

  Where else to get the pulse of the fabricators than on the Fabnet. What is the other alternative, email blasts that no one reads, calling a few of the members that attend the regional conferences, which amounted to 30 companies last I heard.

  ISSFA BOD, welcome to the kinder, gentler Fabnet, where the rules will be enforced.

  Kurt, you've posted on here in the past, what's the worse that can happen at this point, seriously.

Tom:

According to the ISSFA By-Laws, the board meeting minutes are availiable to any fabricator member upon proper request.

The only public redaction I can concieve would be that of personnel. If left to their own descretion, ISSFA executives will obliterate transparency. 

Joe

Edited while doing some more fact checking....back in a bit!

Norm,

Perhaps some members of the board frequent this bulletin board, I don't know, but I will be happy to pass along your invitation.

Please keep in mind that if any choose not to respond it is not necessarily an insult to you. I find there are lots of people out there for whom talking on a public forum simply has no appeal or may even be daunting. Past experience kind of belies the kinder, gentler claim. That doesn't make them less interested or less engaged. At the time of this writing there are 223 people visiting this site. My guess is less than 10% will contribute a post. That doesn't mean they aren't part of the discussion.

Russ

I have passed Tom's request along. I'll let you know what I find out. In the meantime, if you are a fabricator member of ISSFA you should be able to get a copy of the minutes -- at least according to Joe's information. I have no reason to distrust his research. Perhaps you can dileneate the proper procedure, Joe?

I am also informed that any fabricator member has the right to attend any board meeting he/she desires. In fact, there is a visitors' gallery set up for each BOD meeting. All you have to do is communicate your intention to attend 48 hours in advance.

Does ISSFA have a moral obligation to post the minutes in the members section of the website? I think that might be a matter of opinion.