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Are Solid surface and granite natural enemies?
Last Post 07 Feb 2007 03:57 AM by al. 27 Replies.
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al
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al

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30 Jan 2007 01:44 AM

I agree with Reuben.  The finial test needs to be done by either a school or testing lab above reproach.  In the mean time, we can do some bootleg tests to find a test that works well for our purpose.   In the fabricator community prodject section, there are a couple of links to some tests already done.  The kid had a good test, the Marble Institute chose a test that made their product look good.  As Reuben  and Tom suggested, we need a real world test using real kitchens.

There are different gram stains that are capable of dying different bacteria different colors, so we might be able to sort out the begnign bugs from the e.coli we use.

If we get to use actual kitchens, we need to swab before we clean and  after we clean.  I don't imagine people would like us contaminating their tops with chicken juice, so that will have to be done on test tops.

"if it is so safe, why aren't they supporting the testing?"
al
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al

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04 Feb 2007 11:35 PM
Andy, here is the email I sent asking manufacturers for studies or ammo in defense of solid surface.  Wanted to keep you posted on what is happening.  I haven't heard back from Mory on his contacts, but I bet he is covered up right now from reading his posts.
Thanks for letting me use your clout on this matter.  I bet they listen and respond.  Let me know if any of the email is not acceptable and I'll send a correction out.
Hi,
 
.
 
I have permission from Andy Graves, one of the administrators on thefabricatornetwork.com,  to write to you on a subject.  A prodject has been started called "In Defense of Solid Surface", one of the community prodjects you can read about on the fabricator net.  What we are needing is any studies  or information you might have available in digital form if at all possible, that will help answer attacks on our material from those in the stone or engineered stone trade.  Our intention is to post all information we can gather online in one central site to be shared by all who need it.  Of course, we will give credit where due and keep any documents intact to allow accuracy in quoting.
 
In particular, the subject of FDA approval  is  needing adressed.  The stone crowd has been quoting a study from the Hospitality Institute, allegedly paid for by a stainless steel group.  If you guys have any info we could quote or refer to, it would help write responses to the online attacks on forums, answering tilted forum responses, and attacks like the Consumer Report debacle a while back.  I have seen posts on forums from stone fabricators claiming that granite is anti bacterial as a result of this study, as well as hearing customers saying the same thing, in my showroom or at home and garden shows.
 
Also needed, is your views on the warranty chart, one of the prodjects that I started on the Fabricator net.   Our goal is to get manufactures like yourself to agree on what can be agreed upon and then write a universal fabrication manual to use as an industry standard.   If this is done, it will be posted online available for all to use free of charge.
 
We feel this universal manual needs to be the bottom rung, with manufacturers keeping their rights to deviate where neccessary, yet deviating  from universally agreed procedures needs to be done with care and thought.  Our main thoughts are to have universal industry standards so poor quality shop's work can be pointed out with authority.
 
Thanks for your attention to these matters, Al Gerhart
The Carpenter Shop
358 N. Rockwell Ave.
Oklahoma City,  OK  73127
405.942.2644
www.thecarpentershop.net
"if it is so safe, why aren't they supporting the testing?"
Andy Graves


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05 Feb 2007 07:25 AM
Looks good.  Keep us up to date.
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andy@thefabricatornetwork.com
Countertop Company - www.OliveMill.com
Joe Corlett
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05 Feb 2007 02:16 PM
[QUOTE]al wrote
Andy, here is the email I sent asking manufacturers for studies or ammo in defense of solid surface.  Wanted to keep you posted on what is happening.  I haven't heard back from Mory on his contacts, but I bet he is covered up right now from reading his posts.
Thanks for letting me use your clout on this matter.  I bet they listen and respond.  Let me know if any of the email is not acceptable and I'll send a correction out.
Hi,
 
.
 
I have permission from Andy Graves, one of the administrators on thefabricatornetwork.com,  to write to you on a subject.  A prodject has been started called "In Defense of Solid Surface", one of the community prodjects you can read about on the fabricator net.  What we are needing is any studies  or information you might have available in digital form if at all possible, that will help answer attacks on our material from those in the stone or engineered stone trade.  Our intention is to post all information we can gather online in one central site to be shared by all who need it.  Of course, we will give credit where due and keep any documents intact to allow accuracy in quoting.
 
In particular, the subject of FDA approval  is  needing adressed.  The stone crowd has been quoting a study from the Hospitality Institute, allegedly paid for by a stainless steel group.  If you guys have any info we could quote or refer to, it would help write responses to the online attacks on forums, answering tilted forum responses, and attacks like the Consumer Report debacle a while back.  I have seen posts on forums from stone fabricators claiming that granite is anti bacterial as a result of this study, as well as hearing customers saying the same thing, in my showroom or at home and garden shows.
 
Also needed, is your views on the warranty chart, one of the prodjects that I started on the Fabricator net.   Our goal is to get manufactures like yourself to agree on what can be agreed upon and then write a universal fabrication manual to use as an industry standard.   If this is done, it will be posted online available for all to use free of charge.
 
We feel this universal manual needs to be the bottom rung, with manufacturers keeping their rights to deviate where neccessary, yet deviating  from universally agreed procedures needs to be done with care and thought.  Our main thoughts are to have universal industry standards so poor quality shop's work∓nbsp;can be pointed out with authority.
 
Thanks for your attention to these matters, Al Gerhart
The Carpenter Shop
358 N. Rockwell Ave.
Oklahoma City,  OK  73127
405.942.2644
www.thecarpentershop.net

[/QUOTE]

Al:

I took the liberty of editing your solicitation, I hope you don't mind. Use this if you like:

Hello:

We are searching for information regarding the sanitary performance of solid surface countertops. Would you be so kind as to help?

Our goal is to act as an online clearinghouse by posting all the information we collect . We will attribute all information to its respective donor and keep it whole for accuracy. We believe that science will provide an effective counterbalance to the glut of information disseminated by the stone industry's trade asociation public relations department.

We are also working on a universal fabrication manual. May we count on your assistence with this also? Setting and enforcing proper fabrication and installation proceedures raises the bar across our industry, making all of us stronger and more competitive. 

Thanks for your help,

Al

 

Joe

al
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al

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06 Feb 2007 02:41 AM
I like it.  Thanks for the edit, Joe.
"if it is so safe, why aren't they supporting the testing?"
al
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al

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06 Feb 2007 02:46 AM

Andy, I already emailed this, but thought I would share it with the others.

One brand replied positively so far, actually said they are going to include their portion of the standards in their catalog.  Another brand refered us to issfa.  EOS is actively sending info already, Gordon Shell, who I assume is the same Gordon who posts here as well.  Gordon  sent some awesome pics on sealed and unsealed granite , and some ecoli on granite and on solid surface.  I'm working on finding out how to separate the pics from the slide show so I can post them here and on the Defense of Solid Surface page on google.  I also need to get his permission to post them.

"if it is so safe, why aren't they supporting the testing?"
Andy Graves


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07 Feb 2007 01:07 AM

Nice Edit Joe.  Looks like you been at the keyboard once before.

Al,

Keep up the effort and I will help with anything you need after the EXPO.  I got a list a mile long, but I hope to have it all done by March 14.

FabNet Administrator
andy@thefabricatornetwork.com
Countertop Company - www.OliveMill.com
al
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al

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07 Feb 2007 03:57 AM

Andy, keep focused on the show.  I'll keep everyone posted.   Count on a lot of polishing and editing on this project after you get time after the show.  I spoke with Mory tonight about the manual and that guy has a bunch of brands ready to participate.  I'm going to send Mory a rough outine for the manual, and I emphasise rough, tonite before I quit for the night.  I am going though manuals and trying to pick out the common procedures without making it too wordy .  Perhaps once it is done, I can get my wife to set it up as a website with links to an expanded version of each process.  If we make it too long, it won't get read or the important info will be drowned out by the detail.

At some point, we will start posting parts of it here for critque, just remember that brevity is important, we won't write it toward anyone but new fabricators so many things will be left for the advanced version and we need to write it for all brands with separate pages for each brand to list exceptions and additions.  It won't be perfect, but I can count on you guys to catch the obvious as well as the subtle.

"if it is so safe, why aren't they supporting the testing?"
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