I think may of our problems is that we are told over and over that we "have the right" to a big house, lots of toys, big TV's etc etc etc. We have raised a society of spoiled brats. We don't teach responsibility in anything. Someone slips on ice and they sue, its someone elses fault. Actually Greenspan has great responsibility since back in the mid 90s, when Newt and his "republican revolution" came to power, tried to put some restains on credit, he refused and hence. we have people making $15 an hour buying $300,000 houses with no money down. And if thats not bad enought they also buy all the expensive toys.. Huge 4X4 trucks loaded with ATV, snowmobiles, mototcycles and other things they can't afford... Sadly many are going to have to fail, and perhaps then the rest will learn to not spend more than you make. But, when you have certain Politicians that buy votes by promising "free stuff" and making our great grand kids pay for it, what can we expect. We have no leadership at the top, its no wonder we are where were at.

When will congress stop spending like there is no tomorrow? When will WE hold our politician responsible. When will we stop asking for more "free stuff" from our Government? Face it, as long as 50% pay no taxes, and politicians are willing to buy votes it wont stop. And its going to get worse, as more 50% ers come into this country, we may be beyond the tipping point already.
Obama has promised over 1.2 trillion worth of NEW spending, and he has now admitted, he may not be able to give the tax breaks he has promised and will not be able to raise taxes either.. How is he going to pay for his vote buying? Make our great great grandkids pay for it?

Speaking of grand kids,  get your Sarah Palin action figures, 3 models to choose from.  I think they should offerd a talking model too...."drill baby Drill"

Wags,  I have always prided myself on being able to pay my taxes as a self employed person for 20 yrs.  When I get absorbed into all the political crap going on and the rampant spending by gov I go out and do some cash jobs just for me, it always makes me feel better.   Help yourselves I say.  growing up with limited funds with a single parent sure taught me and my 4  bros how to get along in life and do well and feel good about it.   I even went back to my old highschool an chatted with the woodshop class about a path to carpentry leading to succsess.  "everyone needs a home and they all need work "  my montra worked for me

I understand why you take cash once in a while.. Isn't it a shame, we feel that way about our government? It didn't use to be that way, no one likes to pay taxes, but when you feel they are fair and being spend on good causes, at least you can grudginly accept them. I always felt good that I was giving jobs to people, helping to support families etc.

I had that same argument with many school educators. Where I lived they did away with all "Shop" classes, but they did have a ""building trades program" where they actually built houses. I worked with them for 16 years. At the end of each school year, they had an open house at the new home. And each year I would attend and have a discussion with the school board. They would tell me the "trades" were dying. I would ask how much did you pay for a plumber? Or Electrician, or carpenter? They always had that screen saver look on there face. Then they would say well 80% of our kids go onto college. Which may be true, but, as I pointed out, 50% drop off by the end of the freshman year. and you will be lucky to have 20% graduate from college in 4 years.. Then I went on to say, Im the guy that gets YOUR graduates, who can't read a tape measure, can't add 1/4" and 1/2" (both tests I gave, and typically they were failed). That you train these kids for going to college, but you don't train them for making a living, or living life.. Interesting the looks you would get. ;)..

This is what happens, when you have people running the schools, that have never had a "real job". All they have ever done is go to school. Everything in their life is theory... As I told one of the principles, if we had vouchers in this state, you do understand you would be without a job.

I think they were happy when I moved away.. ;)

Hi Wags,

Let me cut to the chase..we elect bribe taking morons to represent us. They get in and they dont represent or fulfill the promises to which they were elected.

Its taxation without representation. Isnt this what got our great country created?. We have come full circle. In the words of Thomas Jefferson..God Forbid the Country be 50 years without a revolution.

Its been way too long. I know you like pitchfofks, but I  think pitchforks are a bit extreme..how about 300 million cheesed off people descending on DC with sporks, grills, charcoal  and condiments?

I like my lying politicians well done. How about you?

Wouild you prefer democrat..or republican..the other white meat? Tastes like chicken or so Im told.



Lenny

I'll bring the tators... we can skewer and BBQ em...

Wags Im honored to call you a friend,

Skewered (or impaled) it is. I love BBQ..lets do em New Orleans style...hahahahaha....might correct a few overlapses in oversight, karmicly speaking.



Lenny

 

I would suggest cajun style, but I may be accused of some hidden racial meaning, so..... now... can we use the pitch forks for the skewers? Please... :)

Wags:

Who wants their daughter to grow up and marry a tradesman?

Nobody, that's who. Everyone thinks their daughter should marry a white-collar guy. As long as we have that attitude, construction jobs will continue to be filled by illegal alians.

I don't see this changing anytime soon.

Joe

It's the attitude of the eliitist, I would be proud if one of my daughters had married a trade person. Heck, in ILL, Carpenters were making upwards of $40 an hour and that was 9 years ago when I left there. Not exactly chump change.

Look at Europe, where apprentace programs are typical, these jobs are respected. Not everyone can, or should go to college, to think so is foolish. A college degree has become what a High School degree use to be. HS degrees are meaningless since "educators" are more interested in being PC than in being educators.

Would you want your daughter to marry a business owner?  The education system seems to forget that most business owners were in the trade themselves before they started their business.  It is always nice if the owner of the electrical contracting company is an electrician.
Same with most business.

When the CA high school exit exams are 8th & 9th grade level questions,  learning the trades would be a step up.

How is everyones stocks doing?  Humm wonder why the person you invest with is called a "broker"? Anyone broker now than when Clinton was in office.   I'm almost all in cash now, I will start placing buy orders when the Dow reaches about 7000.

Kelsey:

Here's a nice counterpoint to yours:

"The conventional wisdom now is that the sky is falling, just as it was a few years ago that home prices would keep skyrocketing ad infinitum. That obviously turned out to be wrong.

The greater fool theory can work in reverse. Investors that keep shorting bank stocks thinking that there's nowhere to go but down may find themselves getting squeezed once the panic subsides.

"With some banks, people are going to look back years from now and kick themselves for not buying them at these prices. There are great opportunities if you do your homework," Tyler said"

http://money.cnn.com/2008/09/11/markets/thebuzz/index.htm?postversion=2008091110

Joe

I just made my yearly SEP contribution (advice from the broker)

The Alaska permenent fund took a HUGE hit yesterday.

Joe, I have been investing for years, and know the theory behind buying at the lows. While that theory is good, I improve my odds by dolar cost averaging.  Sure, when Humana healthcare had trouble, and brought down Wellpoint, I bought more Wellpoint, it was just an industry thing, when one falls, they all fall, even though some has awesome numbers.  This is different, and even with the 1 trillion dollar bailout, there will be some banks that will fail. When the wonderful state of NY told AIG they could take 20 billion of the policyholders money to operate on, that was the key, they touched sacred money. Then you saw everyone trying to redeem money from the money market funds that has ALWAYS had that sacred $1.00 NAV, and for the first time ever, the nav fell below that dollar value.  Let me explain it this way. The vinyl siding just blew off our finacial system, and what is showing is severe termite damage. The feds, just approved a measure to nail the siding back up, but is selling the termite damage to investors in the hopes they will believe they can repair the damage and sell the repair for a profit.  It is the hedge funds moving the markets now. 
      Do I think this bail out will work, yes but slowly.  I think the worst has not hit yet, I hope I am wrong.  I heard one major Credit Card company has hired 70% more workers to deal with late pays....